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CINDY HAS COST US ANOTHER MILLION BUCKS !

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sshm

member

2302 posts

+1 permalink

People do go on and on, don't they . . .

Responding to three "answers" in one paragraph: Having consulted two real (gasp) attorney's the answer is no the contract did not have to be bought out and in fact the Council was told that by their own attorney, as R Wilson said, they chose to ignore it. Preston was over paid in that (a) it did not have to be paid at all (b) it was more than the minimum amount that they would have had to pay if there was a settlement agreement., it was a pay off. If this were your money you would have said, see you in court. Matter of fact not only did the attorneys I spoke to say the contract did not need to be bought out, they responded to the questionable actions by the five Council members who participated in this action.
-1-opinion

The first, and easiest question is this: The lawyers you consulted with ... is their focus actually contractual law or are they known for expertise in other areas? In short, I wouldn't want a lawyer with a specialty in contractual law arguing or providing legal opinion on matters of, say, environmental law. It's great to say you spoke with a lawyer, but were they qualified to offer legal opinion on this, hmmm? The second point that many people here are aware of is that lawyers are free to interpret the law however they choose. It's up to a judge to determine if said interpretation is correct or even with merit.

Council is aware that the new Council has no legal obligation to have Cunningham rammed down their throats the way he was. In fact they were told by their attorney the Preston contract would in fact expire when the new Council was seated. That's why the rush. Cunningham's will as well. A reasonable action was to name him Interim and then allow the set procedures to hire him on a permanent basis. In fact at 125,000.00 he would have competition. I venture to say he will have competition. I feel sorry for him.
-1-opinion

Oh ... you need to go back and look at Mr. Cunningham's contract. If you really believe what you wrote in that above quote, you need to read his contract.

Get ready for the tears, because the QQ floodgates are about to open ...

It's still Checkmate, in case you didn't get a clue.

- SSHM

__________________

"I'm going to show these people what you don't want them to see. I'm going to show them a world without you . . ." - Neo

20th November 2008 19:46 p.m.

confused

member

349 posts

+3 permalink

I'm not laughing. The bottom line to me is that as Anderson County tax payers, we are all losers. How was this whole fiasco possible? That fact that a lame duck county council was able to push these decisions through at the last minute says there are several things really wrong with the policies, regulations and laws which control this council and the administrator. It seems like there better be some changes made to stop the council from having this amount of uncontrolled power.

Mr. Cunningham seems like a really nice fellow, but as he was a part of the current administrative office - what makes his way of doing business any different than Mr Preston's? I thought current thinking was all about CHANGE.

__________________

Good thing words don't charge by the minute.

20th November 2008 20:10 p.m.

ibvirginia

admin

495 posts

+4 permalink

I agree with Confused. I don't mind that there was an attempt to settle things before they exploded, but in this economy, with everything this county needs, we will end up losing over a million to pay someone to get the heck out of Dodge. I've got to get this kind of contract next year. You know, in case we get a new headmaster who doesn't like me, whom I fear might fire me. Seriously?

I try to never agree with prevail on anything, but this is ridiculous and shameful.

I do not like the turn council will take next year. I really, really do not want the anti-everything people in power, but that does not make this right either.

20th November 2008 20:27 p.m.

1-opinion

?

828 posts

+1 permalink

<br />People do go on and on, don't they . . .<br /><br /><br /><br />The first, and easiest question is this: The lawyers you consulted with ... is their focus actually contractual law or are they known for expertise in other areas? In short, I wouldn't want a lawyer with a specialty in contractual law arguing or providing legal opinion on matters of, say, environmental law. It's great to say you spoke with a lawyer, but were they qualified to offer legal opinion on this, hmmm? The second point that many people here are aware of is that lawyers are free to interpret the law however they choose. It's up to a judge to determine if said interpretation is correct or even with merit. [image]<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Oh ... you need to go back and look at Mr. Cunningham's contract. If you really believe what you wrote in that above quote, you need to read his contract.<br /><br />Get ready for the tears, because the QQ floodgates are about to open ...<br /><br />It's still Checkmate, in case you didn't get a clue.<br /><br /><br />- SSHM<br /><br />
-sshm

<br /><br />Oh they were qualified LOL highly. BTW SSHM, all attorneys know how to write contracts and agreements and settlements. The issue is the specific area of legal expertise of contract law but the elements of a contract are all the same. Quick without looking it up, what are the three elements a contract must have?<br /><br />The third element is consideration and this contract fails to contain equitable consideration for both parties. Now is that enough to kill this "contract"? Perhaps perhaps not but taken with the unfortunate statements of the Council members, they had all "talked" to each other to the exclusion of C Wilson & Waldrep  (a.k.a collusion) that creates the possibility to make those five members of Council wish they had not so willingly participated in this travesty. It also adds to the possibility those contracts can be set aside or considered null & void.  Add the rest of the many screw ups that they made after they colluded and you have an interesting prospect to show the rest of Council members in our state what happens when you engage in this kind of politics. As you said, it's up to a Judge to determine all that and come January there will be a Council that seeks better representation for the County and takes on these matters. Five members of this Council made an egregious error and there are enough angry people who expect to see that error rectified. Thankfully, three who will, take their places on Council in 2009 are inclined to keep their promises. <br /><br />So as you like to say in your posts; You hear that Mr. Anderson? That is the sound of inevitability . . . - Agent Smith  One more thing, your answers failed to address the actual questions. As the Council had no legal responsibility to pay off Preston and the anticipated breech had not occurred, what moral victory was there by what was done? It was not honoring a contract which you lamely tired to pass off as the answer. Do you homework before you call someone uneducated. <g> <br /><br /><br /><br />

__________________

You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. ~Author Unknown

20th November 2008 21:07 p.m.

republikin

member

2368 posts

+0 permalink

I'm not laughing. The bottom line to me is that as Anderson County tax payers, we are all losers. How was this whole fiasco possible? That fact that a lame duck county council was able to push these decisions through at the last minute says there are several things really wrong with the policies, regulations and laws which control this council and the administrator. It seems like there better be some changes made to stop the council from having this amount of uncontrolled power.

Mr. Cunningham seems like a really nice fellow, but as he was a part of the current administrative office - what makes his way of doing business any different than Mr Preston's? I thought current thinking was all about CHANGE.

-confused

So-called lame duck elected bodies push stuff through at all levels of government. They are STILL incharge until they leave office. Oh, I forgot, YOU think YOU are incharge. Sorrrry!

20th November 2008 21:13 p.m.

prevail

?

611 posts

-1 permalink

ibvirginia said or dreamed "I try to never agree with prevail on anything."
Virginia, I tried to find where I posted in this thread and can't seem to find it. HoHo. I usually don't like your posts either but if anyone went to the meeting Tuesday night or watched on tv last night and STILL supports Joey Ray, they have to be insane or working for him in a top position or one of his drinking buddies. It was the most disgraceful public meeting in the history of the world.

I posted this on the AIM site this morning and I want sshm to be sure to see it. sshm, you sound like you just woke up from a nightmare. I understand why. None of your picks for council were elected but three you supported got kicked out. Your man Presto is on the way out and Bob and Cindy are still there. Hasn't gone very good for you this year has it? Except your man Hussein Obama did get elected. Go ahead, vent all you want to, we understand.

"Folks, if the outlaw Jesse James had walked into the meeting we would hail him as a good guy as he robbed everyone in the room and presented him with an award for his good works, when compared to what elected officials did to us Tuesday night.
The Gang of Shame made up of Bill McAbee, Ron Wilson, Gracie Floyd, Michael Thompson and Larry Greer are led by Joey Ray 'King' Preston. This Gang has robbed every citizen of Anderson County and demanded that we pay him almost SEVEN years in salary and he will leave.
Curly Bill Brocius is in history books as perhaps the worst and meanest outlaw that ever lived, and certainly the worst outlaw in Arizona history. Picture him as King Joe as he robs us naked using his Gang of Outlaws to enforce his wishes.
Five elected public servants committed an injustice upon the taxpayers of this county. Call them today at work and home and "Thank" them for what they have done to us. We cannot let this travesty go unpunished.
WHAT DOES KING JOE HOLD OVER HIS GANG OF FIVE THAT CAUSED THEM TO SELL THEIR SOULS TO SATAN TO PROTECT THEIR KING?"

20th November 2008 21:22 p.m.

republikin

member

2368 posts

+0 permalink

ibvirginia said or dreamed "I try to never agree with prevail on anything."Virginia, I tried to find where I posted in this thread and can't seem to find it. HoHo. I usually don't like your posts either but if anyone went to the meeting Tuesday night or watched on tv last night and STILL supports Joey Ray, they have to be insane or working for him in a top position or one of his drinking buddies. It was the most disgraceful public meeting in the history of the world.

I posted this on the AIM site this morning and I want sshm to be sure to see it. sshm, you sound like you just woke up from a nightmare. I understand why. None of your picks for council were elected but three you supported got kicked out. Your man Presto is on the way out and Bob and Cindy are still there. Hasn't gone very good for you this year has it? Except your man Hussein Obama did get elected. Go ahead, vent all you want to, we understand.

"Folks, if the outlaw Jesse James had walked into the meeting we would hail him as a good guy as he robbed everyone in the room and presented him with an award for his good works, when compared to what elected officials did to us Tuesday night.The Gang of Shame made up of Bill McAbee, Ron Wilson, Gracie Floyd, Michael Thompson and Larry Greer are led by Joey Ray 'King' Preston. This Gang has robbed every citizen of Anderson County and demanded that we pay him almost SEVEN years in salary and he will leave.Curly Bill Brocius is in history books as perhaps the worst and meanest outlaw that ever lived, and certainly the worst outlaw in Arizona history. Picture him as King Joe as he robs us naked using his Gang of Outlaws to enforce his wishes. Five elected public servants committed an injustice upon the taxpayers of this county. Call them today at work and home and "Thank" them for what they have done to us. We cannot let this travesty go unpunished.WHAT DOES KING JOE HOLD OVER HIS GANG OF FIVE THAT CAUSED THEM TO SELL THEIR SOULS TO SATAN TO PROTECT THEIR KING?"

-prevail

Whoa - take some meds.

20th November 2008 21:52 p.m.

prevail

?

611 posts

-1 permalink

I'm out Repub, can I borrow some from you?

20th November 2008 22:04 p.m.

republikin

member

2368 posts

+1 permalink

I'm out Repub, can I borrow some from you?

-prevail

Ooooh NO - I can't legally despense meds. I'm sorry you are out. It shows you know.

20th November 2008 22:05 p.m.

confused

member

349 posts

+0 permalink

I'm not laughing. The bottom line to me is that as Anderson County tax payers, we are all losers. How was this whole fiasco possible? That fact that a lame duck county council was able to push these decisions through at the last minute says there are several things really wrong with the policies, regulations and laws which control this council and the administrator. It seems like there better be some changes made to stop the council from having this amount of uncontrolled power.

Mr. Cunningham seems like a really nice fellow, but as he was a part of the current administrative office - what makes his way of doing business any different than Mr Preston's? I thought current thinking was all about CHANGE.

-confused

So-called lame duck elected bodies push stuff through at all levels of government. They are STILL incharge until they leave office. Oh, I forgot, YOU think YOU are incharge. Sorrrry!-republikin

Just what do I think I'm in charge of -my opinion. For once I agree, you're right I am. Guess you are also right that you are confused, most of the time. And oooh you're so scary too,

__________________

Good thing words don't charge by the minute.

20th November 2008 22:49 p.m.

republikin

member

2368 posts

+0 permalink

I'm not laughing. The bottom line to me is that as Anderson County tax payers, we are all losers. How was this whole fiasco possible? That fact that a lame duck county council was able to push these decisions through at the last minute says there are several things really wrong with the policies, regulations and laws which control this council and the administrator. It seems like there better be some changes made to stop the council from having this amount of uncontrolled power.

Mr. Cunningham seems like a really nice fellow, but as he was a part of the current administrative office - what makes his way of doing business any different than Mr Preston's? I thought current thinking was all about CHANGE.

-confused

So-called lame duck elected bodies push stuff through at all levels of government. They are STILL incharge until they leave office. Oh, I forgot, YOU think YOU are incharge. Sorrrry!-republikin

Just what do I think I'm in charge of -my opinion. For once I agree, you're right I am. Guess you are also right that you are confused, most of the time. And oooh you're so scary too,

-confused

Don't be upset. We all have limitations.

21st November 2008 03:06 a.m.

buster

member

363 posts

+3 permalink

Prevail -

You asked "What does King Joe hold over his gang of five ...?"

I don't think he holds anything over them. I doubt that you do either.

I love it. I think the five good members of council did the right thing.

Recognizing the "anticipitory" remarks of the three incoming council folks, it is clear that those three seem to have bought Cindy's crap and would have made Joey's life difficult, resulting in a long drawn out legal battle. This would have cost us much more in legal fees, county disruption, and ultimate settlement.

I think they did the right thing in honoring the contract before the next council is seated. They honored their contract. They put a halt to in-fighting and litigation. They freed Joey to pursue employment elsewhere without a lot of baggage. And most of all, they rewarded him for the many great things that he did for Anderson County while constantly being harrassed, followed, called, and accused of the never-substantiated wrong doing.

And hiring Michael Cunningham also prevented the merry band of misfits and ne'er-do-wells from hiring one from their midst and summarily dismantling all that has been done in Anderson County. They did the right thing.

I really love the fact that after years of riding Joey's backside in every possible way, suddenly Cindy is crying "foul"! Serves her right, don't you think?

I don't give free legal advise but I expect many long faces when Ricky's freedom riders get off the bus next week.

30th November 2008 00:46 a.m.

wyatt1sc

member

2715 posts

-1 permalink

Have not heard word-ONE about those "concerned citizens" who rode to Columbia to voice their concerns to the AG office. Maybe the AG is more concerned about the results of the Ethics committee and council members issues brought there instead.

The out going council did the correct thing. They stole the thunder as another put it, and damn glad they did.

As for whatever "KING JOE' holds, I hope it's the jobs of those hiding behind their cyber-screens b*tching about him while taking the same county gub'ment money paid to them for doing equally piss-poor work as well. Just don't hold out for a buy-out. Afraid house cleaning is not done yet folks......

__________________

Designated President of the Warm & Fuzzy Club. DBAA

30th November 2008 23:50 p.m.

1-opinion

?

828 posts

+2 permalink

Have not heard word-ONE about those "concerned citizens" who rode to Columbia to voice their concerns to the AG office. Maybe the AG is more concerned about the results of the Ethics committee and council members issues brought there instead.
The out going council did the correct thing. They stole the thunder as another put it, and damn glad they did.
As for whatever "KING JOE' holds, I hope it's the jobs of those hiding behind their cyber-screens b*tching about him while taking the same county gub'ment money paid to them for doing equally piss-poor work as well. Just don't hold out for a buy-out. Afraid house cleaning is not done yet folks......

-wyatt1sc

Who do you think Cunningham is going to fire? LOL It's past December 1st. Preston is just a contract worker for 27 more days. If Cunningham takes his duties seriously Preston has little juice left.

The bus has not left yet. I wish them the best of luck. I was not for a 1 million exit bonus simply because he held a job for 12 years. Preston has failed to do his job. There are no jobs here for the people. We have empty buildings that could house industry but not much more than that. Now that is a legacy worthy of a million dollars bonus.

__________________

You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. ~Author Unknown

01st December 2008 16:52 p.m.

sshm

member

2302 posts

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We have empty buildings that could house industry but not much more than that. Now that is a legacy worthy of a million dollars bonus.
-1-opinion

Industry and Economic Development, in general, is more than an empty building or a farmer willing to part with one of his pastures. Time and time again, this community has said NO to new infrastructure because *shock* it might cost us a penny or two more at the register.

You must have infrastructure to cull and land business opportunities. For the umpteenth time, FRONTAGE ROADS are NOT THE ANSWER.

In addition, what business in their right mind would want to locate to Anderson when you have a vocal minority making fun of Economic Development and jobs in general. Remember the announcement of the Call Center? That vocal minority was quick and keen to call those 350 jobs "sweatshop" jobs.

Last time I checked, $30k a year wasn't exactly what a sweatshop worker would earn in China.

Now listen closely if you want to understand what successful economic development is:

1.) Decide on an "industry of focus" - You can't be everything to everyone. Look at the area, find the strengths of the workforce, identify the weaknesses, and chase one or two specific industries.

2.) Retail is nice but ... - Retail recruitment (which is what our current Econ Dev group seems to be an expert at) is nice to a point, but it is NOT sustainable. Until the County Economic Development Group can land a REAL industry (Staples etc ... RETAIL not INDUSTRY), nothing has changed, and nothing will.

3.) True Economic Development is from the Private Sector, NOT Government - Econ Dev (Governmental-based) should be nothing more than an interactive repository of information. In other words, a one-stop shop for maps, geological history, regulations, etc. That's ALL that office should EVER be.

The jobs will come. It was not Preston's job to recruit business ... it was his ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT OFFICE. The better question to ask, 1-Opinion, is why with the limited track record of industrial success (*cough* industrial jobs have come from the private sector, not government *cough*) ... why no one has taken steps to call the Econ Dev Office onto the carpet. Like any other sales job, if you fail to produce, there is the door.

Ask that question. Ask how those folks are still there. Ask why that office has not been realigned to be a repository of information.

- SSHM

__________________

"I'm going to show these people what you don't want them to see. I'm going to show them a world without you . . ." - Neo

01st December 2008 17:45 p.m.

1-opinion

?

828 posts

+2 permalink

D'oh I was speaking of empty industrial buildings where infrastructure exists. Please think before you respond. We had industry here and many buildings are now empty.

SWOT analysis, does the Econ. Dev. group know what that is? LOL

Who said anything about expecting government jobs? *ahem* Preston hired Jones, so you are saying he not only hired an incometant employee but he failed to do his job by not "calling her to the carpet?' *hummmmm* - again action worthy of a million dollar bonus. You make my point. Ah well, on to better things for the county. He's just an over paid former employee now.

__________________

You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. ~Author Unknown

01st December 2008 18:22 p.m.

sshm

member

2302 posts

+0 permalink

D'oh I was speaking of empty industrial buildings where infrastructure exists. Please think before you respond. We had industry here and many buildings are now empty.

SWOT analysis, does the Econ. Dev. group know what that is? LOL

Who said anything about expecting government jobs? *ahem* Preston hired Jones, so you are saying he not only hired an incometant employee but he failed to do his job by not "calling her to the carpet?' *hummmmm* - again action worthy of a million dollar bonus. You make my point. Ah well, on to better things for the county. He's just an over paid former employee now.
-1-opinion

Actually, 1-opinion, the existing buildings were included in that.

Here's the problem. The existing infrastructure for those buildings is intended for ONE SPECIFIC INDUSTRY. In most cases, that specific industry is *drumroll* ... textiles. Since those buildings were built to be "mission-specific," you can't re-work those on the fly to support whatever industry knocks on your door. Not to mention, not everyone wants industry in their backyards (again).

Equinox Plant, anyone?

In fact, lets look at the Equinox Plant. It sits in the middle of a residential neighborhood. What business would or could you recruit to this existing building that could start work almost immediatly with little to no refit costs. Oh, lets not forget not reducing the quality of life of the local neighborhood by dropping an industry BACK in that location.

The key here is turn-key. We have NOTHING that is turn-key. No one wants to pay for it. I would ask the same for you: THINK before you issue flippant replies.

Now, as for the existing Economic Development Office, I believe this is one point where you and I will agree (shock, I know). Yes, I do believe that the Econ Dev Office has not met the needs of economic developers (private sector). Yes, I do believe that the inability for the Econ Dev Office to land anything of any significance beyond retail is a testament to a lack of knowledge on HOW to recruit. Yes, I do believe that if you fail to perform (in this case, deliver), then you should be dismissed. Yes, I agree with you that Econ Dev would likely not understand SWOT, either in theory or real-world application.

- SSHM

__________________

"I'm going to show these people what you don't want them to see. I'm going to show them a world without you . . ." - Neo

01st December 2008 18:54 p.m.

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